Fred Burn Co.

NAME LISTS AND THEIR USEVirtually every inquiry or buyer’s name ultimately ends up on amailing list.
Some are small lists, while others containmillions of names.
Some are meticulously maintained, whileothers are carelessly handled.
For those interest in mail order advertising, mailing lists canprove to be very valuable as well as a saleable commodity.
Ifyou wish to increase your sales, it is often a good idea to gointo direct mail.
To do this you would begin by renting anotherfirm’s mailing lists.
Or, you would rent your list ofcustomers’ names to another firm.
Either way, mailing listscan, and do play an important part in the every day world ofmail order.
Basically, there are three types of lists.
They are: - house lists - mail response lists - compiled lists.
Let’s examine each more closely.
HOUSE LISTSA house list simply put is a list of your own customers.
Theymay be active, or inactive.
They may be inquiries or buyers.
They may have made ten purchases or just one, or in the case ofinquiries, none.
They may have placed an order in the last fourmonths, or in the last four years.
They may have spent a greatdeal of money or a small amount.
They may be credit card buyersor cash buyers.
Your house list contains your most valuable asset .
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thenames of your own customers.
These are the people who havepurchased from you in the past and are very likely to purchasefrom you in the future.
You can spend a great deal of money torent outside lists, but none will bring you the financialrewards you will reap from your own customer list.
These peopleknow and trust you, and will order on a continuing basis.
MAIL RESPONSE LISTSSecond in importance are mail response lists.
These are peoplewho have responded to another firm’s direct mail offer.
Theidea is to pick out a list of customers who have orderedproducts similar to those sold by your firm.
Since it is awell-known fact that these people have previously responded toan offer similar to yours, there is an excellent chance thatthey will also respond favorably to your offer.
COMPILED LISTSAlthough the people on compiled lists do not usually respond aswell as the people on house lists or mail response lists, theselists can still be helpful if properly used.
These lists arenot generally used by small or medium sized business firmsbecause they are too general in nature.
But large firms, suchas oil companies and insurance firms find them useful and evenprofitable.
I have never used a compiled list and do notrecommend their use for anyone but the largest mailers.
While there are no set rules which can be applied to mailinglists, here are few “rules of thumb” that can be regarded asreliable in most cases.
They may not apply to your listsituation, but they will give you food for thought.
The average list will change at least 15%-20% each year.
Somemailing lists will change only 10%, while others have as high asa 100% rate of turnover.
(Lists of high school seniors), etc.
A direct response list (people who have already purchased goodsthrough the mail) will out-pull a compiled list.
A customer list will out-pull all other outside lists.
Byoutside list I mean direct response or compiled lists.
Allocate 10% or more of your direct mail budget to listdevelopment and maintenance.
The 10% figure is the minimumamount you should spend.
Most successful businesses find themore they spend the more they prosper.
People over 35 years of age as a group, respond to mail orderoffers at a much higher rate than do people under 35 years ofage.
People living in rural areas respond to mail order offers at ahigher rate than do people who live in urban areas.
People who have ordered through the mail within the last 3 - 6months (”hot-line” buyers) are the most productive names you canget.
Multiple buyers (people who have made two or more separatepurchases through the mail within a season) will always outpullbuyers who have purchased only once within a season.
The results you can expect will vary by season and/or months ofthe year, and by regional areas and states.
Every list should be checked and cleaned at least twice a yearor more.
It is a good idea to review and update your list atleast every six months whenever possible.
Responsibility for maintaining and updating of your list shouldbe delegated to a single individual whenever possible.
We’veheard the expression “too many cooks spoil the broth”, well,when it comes to mailing lists it is a good idea to limit thenumber of individuals who handle the list to as few as ispossible.
The fewer the better.
Use outside consultants and service organizations to help youwith your list decision.
These people have made it theirbusiness to study and understand lists.
SHOULD YOU USE LISTSThe first thing to consider when trying to make a decision abouta particular list is whether or not the people on that listwould be interested in your product.
You want a list of peoplewho have purchased something similar to your product, or atleast something in the same general category.
People who havealready purchased cheese products are perfect for you if you areselling cheese products.
But, if you are selling fishingsupplies you would never want to rent a list of buyersinterested in cheese products.
Instead, you would want to renta list of people interested in fishing.
You might considerrenting a list of names from a publisher who publishes a fishingmagazine.
Or maybe, a list of people who have recently appliedfor a fishing license.
When renting lists it is imperative tofind a list that parallels as closely as possible your own listof customers.
The right list can and usually does make atremendous difference in the results you can expect.
WHAT TO SPENDToday, there are thousands of mailing lists available inthousands of categories.
Almost any offer, no matter howunusual, can be matched to an appropriate list.
The price of amailing list can start from as low as $15 per thousand to ashigh as $75 per thousand and more.
A few of the factors thatdetermine the price of a mailing list are:- Freshness of list.
- Buyer or inquiry.
- Amount of purchase.
- Multiple or one time buyer.
- “Hot-line” buyers.
- Credit card buyers.
- Frequency of purchase.
- Brokers recommend it’s use.
As you can see, many factors come into play when pricing amailing list.
The more desirable the list, the more you canexpect to pay.
LIST BROKERS AND COMPILERSIt is almost impossible to succeed in direct marketing withoutthe help and guidance of competent list brokers and compilers.
It is the list broker’s job to bring together the owner of alist and the firm who wishes to rent that particular list.
Thefee for this service is usually a flat 20% on each rental.
Youcan rent names through a list broker for the same price youwould pay on your own.
So, it is to your benefit to takeadvantage of this service.
It is to the broker’s advantage tohelp you choose the best list available for your needs, so thatif your initial test proves successful, there is a good chanceyou will wish to rent the whole list in the future.
After a list broker arranges the rental, he next bills the firmrenting the list and forwards the proper payment to the owner ofthe lists.
These services are all included in his fees.
A list compiler represents those lists owned and maintained bythe company that employs him.
They are specialists for thecompiled list they represent.
Basically, the compiler offersthe same services as a broker.
NAME LISTS - A PROFITS CENTER FOR YOUMany companies with as few as a few thousand names are earning asubstantial income from the rental of their list.
Larger firmswho have lists in excess of 50,000 names are reaping hugerewards.
If you will simply bear in mind the fact that thesesmall companies with small lists are able to gross $40,000 ayear and more in rental income fees alone, you begin to grasp ameasure of the significance of just how profitable the buyingand selling of names can be for you.
It is truly a profitcenter without parallel in the mail order industry.
List prices depend on the time and money you spent compilingthem.
Some lists are easily accessible and you cannot charge agreat deal for them.
Other lists require a great deal of timeand money to compile.
These lists are usually very expensive.
NOTE: You have probably seen many dealers advertising theirlists at cut-rate prices.
In most cases these lists areworthless or so out-of-date that they are no longer of any useto anyone, except to sell to unsuspecting mail order buyers.
Try to stay away from these dealers.
Most of them are sellinggarbage.
YOUR OWN LISTOnce you have gotten your mail order business off the ground andhave acquired a large enough list of inquiries or buyers, orboth, it is a good idea to put your customer list up for rentalwith as many brokers as possible.
While it is true that the primary purpose of compiling your ownlist of customers is to generate sales of your own products; animportant secondary source of income can be generated throughthe rental of your list to non-competing firms.
Profits fromthe rental of house lists can be enormous.
It is not uncommonfor many mail order businesses to make more money from therental of their lists than they earn form the rest of theirbusiness.
Indeed, if it were not for the monies received fromlist rentals, many a mail order firm would soon be forced to goout-of-business.
For example, let us assume taut you have a customer list of50,000 names.
This list is considered small by most experts,but it will still account for hefty revenues.
If you charge $40per thousand names, you will receive $2,000 each time you rentyour list.
Of course, you will have to allow for the brokerscommission of 20% or $400.
That still leaves you with $1,600,assuming there are no other costs involved.
If you rent yourlist ten times during the course of a year you should netapproximately $16,000.
Another benefit of renting your list to non-competing firms isthat you will be able to get new ideas and insights about whatyour customers’ likes and dislikes are.
In addition, one of thefirms that rents your list may try an approach that you mightwant to imitate.
Many firms rightly or wrongly, refuse to rent their house listto another firm.
They feel that the results of their futuremailings will be diluted if their customers are deluged withoffers from other companies.
Other firms feel just the oppositeis true.
They state that as long as they rent their list to anon-competing firm no harm will be done.
In fact, many feelthat by renting their list to other companies, they are helpingto insure that their customers continue to be mail order buyers.
Still other firms take a middle-of-the-road approach to therenting of their list.
These firms make sure they rent onlytheir old subscribers list or inactive customer list.
They donot rent their current subscribers list or the names of theiractive customers.
Finally, there are the firms who like to exchange lists withboth their competitors and non-competitors.
Usually, onlyinquiries of inactive customers names are swapped.
The bestparty of list swapping is the cost.
If you would normally haveto pay $40 per thousand names for a list, you can get it foronly $8 per thousand names when you swap lists.
(You pay onlythe brokers fee, or 20% of $40.
)FUNCTIONS OF LIST BROKERSThe DMAA research report lists the most important servicesperformed by list brokers.
FINDS NEW LISTS - The broker is constantly seeking new lists andselecting for your consideration ones which will be ofparticular interest.
In fact, brokers spend a great deal oftheir time encouraging list owners to enter the list rentalfield.
ACTS AS A CLEARING HOUSE FOR DATA - The broker saves youvaluable time because you can go to one source for aconsiderable amount of information, rather than to many sourceswhich may or may not be readily available.
SCREENS INFORMATION - The broker carefully screens the listinformation provided by the list owner.
Where possible he orone of his representatives personally verifies the informationprovided by the list owner.
In addition, brokers in theNational Council of Mailing List Brokers have available to thema wealth of information resulting from the combined efforts ofthe members.
REPORTS ON PERFORMANCE - The broker knows the past history ofmany lists and usually knows the performance of ones which havepreviously been used by other mailers.
ADVISES ON TESTING - The broker’s knowledge of the makeup of alist is often valuable in determining what will constitute arepresentative cross section of the list.
Obviously, an errorin selecting a cross section will invalidate the results of thetest and possibly eliminate from your schedule a group of namesthat could be responsive.
CHECKS INSTRUCTIONS - When you place an order with a list ownerthrough a broker, he and his staff double check the accuracy andcompleteness of your instructions, thus often avoidingunnecessary misunderstandings and loss of time.
CLEARS OFFER - The broker clears for you in advance the mailingyou wish to make.
He supplies the list owner either with asample of your piece or a description of it, and by gettingprior approval minimizes the chance of any later disappointments.
CHECKS MECHANICS - The broker clears with the list owner theparticular type of envelope, order card, or other material whichis to be addressed.
CLEARS MAILING DATE - When contacting the list owner, the brokerchecks on the mailing date which you have requested and asksthat it be held open as a protected time for you.
WORKS OUT TIMING - The broker arranges either for material to beaddressed or labels to be sent to you at a specified time, thusenabling you to maintain you schedule of inserting and mailing.
LIST OWNER-BROKER RELATIONSGET LIST MAINTENANCE ADVICE - Consult with the list broker whendeciding how to maintain your list so you may set it up the mostpractical, economical and rentable way.
DISCUSS RATES - Discuss with your broker the price you willcharge for rentals and decide on a price schedule that willbring you the greatest volume of profitable business.
SUPPLY ACCURATE DATA - Be sure the list information you furnishis accurate.
If the addresses in a list have not been correctedwithin a reasonable period of time, tell the broker.
If a list contains a percentage of names of people who bought onopen account and failed to pay, give this information to thebroker.
If you represent your list as made up entirely of buyers, besure it does not include any inquiry or prospect names.
If you have bought out a competitor and have included some ofhis names in your customer list, be sure to state this fact.
Aside from obvious aspects of misrepresentation, you will be theone who suffers when you mislead a broker.
ADDRESS ON SCHEDULE - Establish a reputation for addressing ontime as promised.
If you accept orders and fail to fulfil themon schedule, brokers become aware of this and find they can notconscientiously suggest your list to potential users.
If, forsome reason, you foresee a delay, advise the broker immediately,so he can advise the mailer.
FURNISH LATEST COUNTS - Keep the broker posted on current listcounts, rates, changes in the sources of the names and the like.
When the composition of a list changes, it may very well becomemore interest to a user who had previously felt that it was notsuitable for his purpose.
In addition, when current informationis offered to a potential user through the broker, it is morelikely to develop activity than is an out-dated description.
CHOOSE BROKERS WISELY - Consider carefully whether to make yourlist available to a number of list brokers or just to onebroker.
There are many things to be said in favor or workingwith several brokers.
And at times there are also some goodreasons for working exclusively with one broker.
While thedecision is yours, you should keep in mind the fact that brokersare people and each has his own particular personality,following, and sphere of influence.
Therefore, as a list owner,you will be well advised not to narrow the field unless yourfacilities for addressing are so limited that the orders onebroker can develop for you will be more than sufficient to takeup all the available addressing time.
PROTECT BROKERS - It takes a lot of time and effort on the partof a broker to interest a mailer in testing your list.
Therefore, continuation runs should be scheduled through theoriginal broker so long as he continues to render satisfactoryservice to his client.
The broker is a member of your salesforce, and he can only continue to do an effective job so longas you protect him on the accounts he develops for you.
Recently there has been a trend toward list management asopposed to list brokers.
A list manager takes over completemanagement of your list for rental purposes.
Under this form ofcontract, the list manager is responsible for the followingfunctions:- He solicits his own brokerage customers directly.
- Makes all contacts with list brokers and is responsible forprocessing their orders.
- Should at his own expense advertise the list.
- Analyzes the results of each mailing and offer suggestions andadvice.
- Keeps all records and is responsible for all billings.
- Provides the list owner with a detailed list of activity, alongwith commissions earned, etc.
For this extra service he usually earns an additional 10%.
Today, however, many list managers are asking for and gettingeven more.
In my opinion, they are well worth the extra money.
A good list manager will do his utmost to promote your list.
Inreturn, he will earn a substantial sum of money.
But, not asmuch as the list owner.
It is not unusual for a good listmanager to double or even triple your previous rental income.
Naturally, some list mangers will do a better job than others.
If you decide to use a list manger instead of a broker, makesure you select the best one available.
It will take some time,but it will be time well spent.
I strongly suggest you subscribe to Direct Marketing Magazine,224 Seventh St.
, Garden City, NY 11530.
This magazine willkeep you abreast of the latest information available dealingwith direct marketing and list selection.
HOW TO TEST A LISTToday the minimum number of names you are allowed to test isusually around 5,000.
However, many brokers will waive thisrule.
They do not want to lose a potentially good customer justbecause he or she wants to test 3,000 names instead of 5,000.
When testing a list always request Nth selection.
This willinsure that you will be testing the effectiveness of the entirelist, and not just one small segment.
Nth selection simplymeans that the computer randomly picks a few names from theentire list.
The reason you should always use Nth selection issimple, besides the obvious reason already mentioned.
It stopsthe broker or list owner from giving you his loaded names.
Manya shrewd broker or list owner will rent you only their bestnames when you test a list.
This will insure that you will getthe best results possible.
Later, when you return foradditional names, you will get the shock of your life.
In order for a beginner to get a trustworthy list it might be agood idea to rent your first nm large, reputable firm.
Later,as you grow, tests can be made with lists from smaller firms.
Another reason for selecting larger lists is, that should theresults be rewarding, you will have a larger selection of namesfor your future use.
Always try to rent a list consisting of buyers names only.
Themore recent the better.
If you cannot get a list of buyersnames only, go for a mixed list.
This particular list willconsist of both buyers and inquiries names.
Once again, it isadvisable to get the freshest names possible.
Note: Always make certain that any list you decide to rent hasbeen cleaned within the last 6-12 months.
Otherwise, you may bethrowing your time and money away.
Lists that have not beenkept up-to-date deteriorate rapidly.
Many lists are totallyworthless unless they are constantly cleaned.
WHO BUYS MAILING LISTSAll mail order experts agree that there is no less expensiveway to increase their sales than by using the medium of directmail.
The problem all direct mail users face is where can theyobtain the lists they need to continue their mailing campaigns.
That is where the “mailing list dealer” come in.
By being ableto supply these firms with names of authentic mail orderprospects he or she is able to build a very successful business.
Once a firm has faith in you and the list you furnish, you canbe assured that they will continue to use your service as longas you give them the same excellent service and results as inthe beginning.
Remember, the compiling and selling names is avery competitive business, and yet many aspirants, most withlittle or no knowledge of the business, strike it rich in thisfield.
However, you must at all times offer your clientstop-notch service and order-pulling lists.
HOW TO GET STARTEDTo be frank and candid, your chances of success are almostnon-existent unless you have primary knowledge of mail orderselling in general.
So, it would be prudent to start out inanother phase of mail order selling if you are a mail orderneophyte.
The starting supplies needed to operate a mailing list businessare moderate and inexpensive.
You’ll definitely need atypewriter (the best one you can possibly afford).
Additionally, you’ll need the following supplies .
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letterheads and envelopes, business cards, record books, somesort of filing cabinet, sheets of perforated gummed labels,(available at most stationery stores), carbon paper, shippingenvelopes or containers, pens and pencils and a few othersupplies as you start to grow.
There are two ways for beginners to compile name lists: (1) Onstandard gummed labels, (available from your local stationerystore) (2) Computer labels, from a home computer or a largemain frame computer, (available from firms who specialize inthis field).
Since this book is primarily for beginners we willfirst discuss the gummed labels.
Later in this book there is asection devoted to computer lists.
Mailing lists are usually typed on sheets of perforated gummedlabels ready to affix to envelopes.
These standard sheets ofperforated gummed labels come in 33 up sheets.
Their cost isusually around $25 per thousand sheets.
You can also offer thecustomer name lists on plain bond paper, usually there are from35-60 names typed on a plain piece of paper.
I do not generallyrecommend this method of name selling since it usually indicatesthe seller is a rank amateur.
It is usually a good idea to sellyour list on either gummed or pressure sensitive labels only.
Later, as you expand, you will want to use a method of listcompiling that will allow you to put the names in exact zip codeorder.
This is a very important factor when it comes to sellingyour list of names.
But in the beginning, you will not have theexperience or money needed to properly zip code your list.
When buying gummed, perforated labels, you should always get theones with the carbon already inserted between each sheet ofpaper.
In this manner, you will be able to type the name onceon the original and have as many as 5 additional copies of eachfor sale.
Another method of reproduction of your mailing list is a copymachine.
You simply insert your master copy into the machineand copy as many sheets as you need.
You can do this forpressure sensitive labels as well as gummed labels.
If you canafford to rent, lease or buy your own copy machine it willgreatly increase your volume and also your profit potential.
There are many, many people using the above methods to reproduceand sell their name lists.
Many are making a small fortune.
But, the real big money cannot be made until you computerizeyour list.
HOW TO COMPUTERIZE AND MAINTAIN YOUR MAILING LIST FOR GREATERPROFITSProbably the one question most frequently asked by mail orderlist compilers is, should I or shouldn’t I computerize my list?The answer is, “that depends”.
There are many factors to beconsidered before you make up your mind one way or the other.
But, one thing is for sure, if computerizing your list is rightfor you, it will improve your profit potential in 2 ways .
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(1) By a more efficient marketing of your list (2) Byincreasing your income from the rental of your list.
Until recently, it was not a good idea to computerize your listif it contained fewer than 15,000-20,000 names.
Today, however,with the aid of small office and home computers, anyone caneasily store and print out a large amount of names.
So, if you plan on increasing the size and profitability of yourlist, computerizing your list isn’t only desirable, it’svirtually indispensable.
HOW TO CLEAN YOUR LISTYou clean your list by putting the caption “address correctionrequested” in the upper left hand corner of your outer envelopewhen you mail to your own list.
Or, you can offer yourcustomers 10 new names for every 1 old name they return to you.
This way you would not have to send out any mailings yourself.
Your customers would be cleaning the list for you.
Remember,computerized lists are like children.
You have to maintain themafter you’ve brought them into the world.
List maintenance is principally a matter of adding new names,deleting “nixies” (undeliverable mail) and entering changes ofaddress as customers move.
None of these tasks are difficult,but without the proper care and dedication a good list can soonbecome worthless.
WHERE TO OBTAIN NAMES FOR YOUR LISTNaturally, you can rent out your own list of customers if youhave such a list.
This is the way most beginners start.
Wehave previously discussed this aspect of name rentals.
You canalso compile other types of name lists.
Examples .
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doctors,lawyers, drug stores, high school students, etc.
Several booksand directories have been published that specifically deal withthese types of lists.
Two of the best are “Mailing ListSources”, and “Mailing List Directory”.
These books are notcheap, so if you do not wish to buy them, they are available atmost large public libraries.
Another valuable sources for thesetypes of lists is “Guide to American Directories for CompilingMailing Lists”.
Another method of compiling names for a name list is to purchasethe names from a mail order dealer.
Many small mail order firmshave no use for their names after they answer the originalinquiry.
They are only too glad to sell these names to thehighest bidder.
The price you offer for these names is usuallyjust a fraction of what they would have cost you if you had paidfor the advertisements yourself.
I know of one list compilerwho has become a very rich man using this method.
He sends outa form letter to mail order dealers who advertise in theclassified sections of magazines.
He offers to buy theircurrent names and all their names in the future for a fairprice.
After he acquires these names, he has them put on acomputer listing and sells them to some of the biggest mailorder firms in the country.
He has been doing this for a longtime and he probably is the king of the opportunity-seekers namelist market.
WHAT PRICES TO CHARGEThe price you charge for your list can vary greatly.
Basically,lists, like any other commodity, have different values.
Always remember to keep your prices in line with what the otherlist sellers are charging.
If you charge too little, mostpeople will shy away, figuring that your list is not that good.
On the other hand, if you set your price too high, mostprospects will be financially unable or unwilling to spend toogreat a sum of money.
Always try to be moderate in your pricestructure.
If you are having good results renting your list,you might try raising the price slowly and see what happens.
Never jump your price too rapidly if at all possible.
Thistends to scare away many good prospects and old customers.
HOW TO ADVERTISEThere are many and varied methods of reaching prospective buyersof your lists.
We will try to discuss a few in this chapter.
Please remember, that there are literally dozens of other waysto reach customers.
We cannot and will not cover all themethods, but we will attempt to cover some of the most widelyused methods.
Advertise in various trade and business publications.
There aremagazines like Zip Magazine and Direct Marketing Magazine thatlist dozens of mailing lists in each issue.
These ads areusually placed by the list broker, list manager or the listowner.
This is probably the best method to use if you are goingafter big results.
It costs a little, but it is well worth theprice.
You can also advertise your list in business opportunitymagazines and periodicals.
There are hundreds of thesepublications available for you to choose from.
You will have tomake test to see which one works the best for you.
You can place classified ads in magazines.
Many advertisers usethis method because it is cheap and yet reaches a very largeaudience.
Never ask for money directly from a classified ad.
These ads should be used only to solicit inquiries.
When youreceive the prospective buyer’s inquiry, you send them all therelative information about your list.
Price, names, zip code.
Another very profitable method used by list sellers is to rent alist of prospective buyers from another seller.
Once you attainthis list, you mail out your list information to this list.
EXAMPLE .
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If you are selling a list containing the names ofpeople who have inquired about a book on weight-watching, youmight try to rent a list of names from another dealer who isselling a book dealing with the same subject.
You would ask the other dealer to send you a list of all thepeople who have rented his list.
Since they rented his list ofpeople interested in weight-watching, there is a good chancethey would be interested in renting a similar list from you.
As previously stated, there are many more ways for you to reachprospective buyers.
The list of inventive ways is almostendless.
It is up to you to find out which method works bestfor you.
There is no short-cut - the only way to accomplishthis is by constantly testing all the methods until you hit theright one for you and for your list.
HOW TO PROTECT YOUR LISTSIf a mailer rents your list and is not specifically givenpermission to mail to it more than one time, and does so, thenhe is guilty of fraud.
The Postal Service frowns on anyone whodoes this through the mail and the offender can be sued fordamages as well.
The best way to catch anyone doing this is toseed your list.
Put the names and addresses of about a dozenpeople in the list and alert them to inform you if they receivemore than one mail offer from the same person or firm.
The factthat they do so does not automatically mean that you have beendefrauded.
As you learned from the information presented, it ishighly probable that the name is on more that one list.
It isworth investigating though and I would investigate before filingany formal charges.
The best way to prevent multiple mailings is to include a letterwith the name list informing the renter that the list is seededand threaten prosecution for misuse.
No mailer in his rightmind wants problems with Uncle Sam or his Postal Service, andsuch a letter will cause an unscrupulous person to have secondthoughts about taking liberties with your list.
HOW TO GET HELP FROM THE EXPERTSIt is a fact of life that no one will want to help you if hethinks you are trying to take the food out of their family’smouth.
It is no different in the list selling and compilingfield.
If you need to, I would call some of the biggest namesin the mailing list business and tell them that I was interestedin having my list of names managed by them.
I would tell themthat my list contained 50,000 buyers of mail order books.
As wediscussed my list, I would ask a few off-the-cuff questions thatI needed answered.
Since they were interested in managing mylist, they would only be too glad to answer any and all of myquestions.
You might say that my methods were sneaky and notabove board.
I would say that I did what I had to do toincrease my knowledge of the mailing list business.